Experiment with the Arudhas....A Research

[Rohiniranjan]

If I may....as we talk on Arudha padas, can we also ponder on the situation that the Arudha lagna falls only in the houses 3,4,5 and 9, 10, 11.

Or atleast, this is my observation. Viewing it in the North Indian diamond chart, it seems to be sending a signal perhaps. The symmetry of bhavas both on the visible and the invisible half of the chart is rather intriguing.

Interestingly of the so called dusthana or the houses 6, 8 and 12...the AL cannot be there.

Similarly, amongst the Upachaya bhavas, minus the Sixth, there is a 50 % probability of AL falling in an upachaya bhava.

Again, if we take both the trikona and the kendras, there is a 66% probability of the AL being in one of the trikonas or the kendras.

The natural corollary is that in the remaining cases the AL is in the Upachayas. This happens too only when the Lagna lord posits in the second, eighth houses for the AL to be in the third house and when the Lagnesh settles in the sixth and the twelvfth  that the AL is seen in the Laabh bhava. For the Lagna lord to be in the even houses...except the kendra bhavas of fourth and tenth, the AL is in the upachayas certainly.  

In my opinion, AL in third or 8th from 8th brings the sixth from  AL in focus , in this case, a  loaded bhava . Should be a person to whom people gravitate towards naturally, certainly not a recluse. With strong communication channel capability!

votive

My dear Votive,

My first (knee-jerk tendency) was to write to you privately, but then decided to voice my feelings and thoughts publicly. I am not sure why but after reading your thoughts I felt very proud of you! I have been fairly upset, lately, at what I have been reading on Yahoo fora and have been wondering at times: Whither Jyotish...?

Your thoughts provided much *healing* because this is indeed how modern jyotish afficianados must apply their minds to Jyotish. Long ago when I was gradually absorbing astrology from whatever source available: ancient, quasi-ancient and contemporary, I found it remarkable and somewhat disturbing that jyotish still remains imprisoned in minds as a religious entity, where gospel even where questionable remains walled-in like Anarkali! I also was a bit flummoxed by the nearly-TOTAL absence of any examples or real charts in nearly ALL ancient and quasi-ancient literature on Jyotish. More lately, the war (verbal skirmish?) seems to have become focused on and between contemporary jyotish scholars and such wasteful agendas. All this pains me personally, even though I have never had any personal associations with any group or following etc.

Though some may hastily run away from what they think is khichdi, but really it is kheer! Ma used to make kheer at birthdays and always included in her recipe, meva (kernels of dry fruit and nuts). Some children that loved both ate the combo and enjoyed it, others more discriminatory, first skimmed off the meva and enjoyed those, then enjoyed the rest of the kheer. Which one enjoyed the paayesh more, is hard to tell because both groups had a contented smile on their happy faces when they were done!

I liked the way you approached the matter of padas and rightly identified that only six houses can ever have the privilege of hosting the padas (moorings) for the 12 houses in any chart.

In addition to the statistical probabilities you provided, the repeating order (2x) of the padas (for the 12 possible placements of the lord of a house) are interesting to note as well (2nd layer of consideration, with the identification of the padas being the first layer), The 2nd layer repeating pattern (harmonic?) closely following the first half and the 2nd half of the chart in a paired dance of cosmic order. A third layer would be the pairing of different houses with the same pada, as if in a group - namely:
Pada  --  Layer 1
10  --  1, 7
3  --  2, 8
5  --  3, 9
4  --  4, 10
9  --  5, 11
11  --  6, 12
A subtle harmonic relationship would hint at a functional pairing between:
11-6,12 (11th house working in tandem with 6th and 12th houses which are connected through the pada linkages)
but 1, 2, 6, 7, 8, 12 being devoid of such linkages (not part of the elite pada group a sort of trisomy endowed with a degree of freedom-of-choice perhaps? Somewhat unencumbured??).

Let us think about that...! For these houses may generally represent the points on which the nativity must work upon and build, for better *mansions* that are in future, even distant future...?

I hope what I am thinking inside is coming across clearly and in an error-free manner (if the interface is working fluidly!).

BPHS gives an order of expression (sudarshan chakra chapter) whereby the planet placed in a house is the highest in expression (the floating and visible meva in the kheer). In charts where a jyotish stellium (has looser orbs than the tropical-seasonal astrolgy tradition!) is placed becomes a key house in terms of phal-bhog in a lifetime. If the dispositor of the stellium happens to be the AL or even AK or Lagna lord (one or more of these) indeed has the potential to be a major driver in life. As in the case you focused upon!

Thanks, Love and Light!

Rohiniranjan

I am not understanding this.

Rishi

Ranjanda,

Thankyou for your generous praise. If I may be allowed to question a bit more...

There is a visible and elegant harmony in the Arudha concept. If one looks at a trine of 1, 5, 9 , they complement each other to create a whole. If one looks at the other trines...12,1,2;  3,4,5 and so on...they flank and supplement to form an arrow or a wedge , maybe there are better descriptions around. The Arudha then a part of such trines and the bhavas not having the Arudhas too create a pattern.

So, why is the 12, 1, 2 a  trine  which is devoid of the pada?
More significantly, why are the 1 and 7 the leaders of such trines?
Why is the 4/10 axis more prominent for the Padas?
Is it some indication of our current duties in the present?

It is also worthwhile to note that if we notice the AL on the visible ( Sun/daylight/ Father/Path/ Duties/ Light ) part of the chart or the invisible ( Moon/night/Ma/Resources/Love) part.
AL in 3,4,5 bhavas ( Lagna Lord in 2,3,4,8,9,10) and AL in 9,10,11 bhavas ( Lagna Lord in 1,5,6,7,11,12) there is yet another beautiful and vivid symmetry. Depending on the sequencing of the chart, the person can come across as (or appear) to be focused either more on people or on the task, more emotional or more logical, the ida nadi more prominent or the pingla nadi. The continuum could either be benevolent or harsh, when we speak of "people" orientation it could imply a hermit or a Gandhi.
If, of course, as you pointed out, the AL is linked facilely to other key indicators, the flow is smoother, if not how do we try and work on it.

votive

Thereafter, I am not understanding this too!

Rishi

Hehe, looks like votive and i went a bit too deep for your and ChanDubai's comfort! Remarkable difference in reactions, though! <LOL>

Rohiniranjan

[Rohiniranjan]

Ranjanda,

Thankyou for your generous praise. If I may be allowed to question a bit more...

There is a visible and elegant harmony in the Arudha concept. If one looks at a trine of 1, 5, 9 , they complement each other to create a whole. If one looks at the other trines...12,1,2;  3,4,5 and so on...they flank and supplement to form an arrow or a wedge , maybe there are better descriptions around. The Arudha then a part of such trines and the bhavas not having the Arudhas too create a pattern.

So, why is the 12, 1, 2 a  trine  which is devoid of the pada?
More significantly, why are the 1 and 7 the leaders of such trines?
Why is the 4/10 axis more prominent for the Padas?
Is it some indication of our current duties in the present?

It is also worthwhile to note that if we notice the AL on the visible ( Sun/daylight/ Father/Path/ Duties/ Light ) part of the chart or the invisible ( Moon/night/Ma/Resources/Love) part.
AL in 3,4,5 bhavas ( Lagna Lord in 2,3,4,8,9,10) and AL in 9,10,11 bhavas ( Lagna Lord in 1,5,6,7,11,12) there is yet another beautiful and vivid symmetry. Depending on the sequencing of the chart, the person can come across as (or appear) to be focused either more on people or on the task, more emotional or more logical, the ida nadi more prominent or the pingla nadi. The continuum could either be benevolent or harsh, when we speak of "people" orientation it could imply a hermit or a Gandhi.
If, of course, as you pointed out, the AL is linked facilely to other key indicators, the flow is smoother, if not how do we try and work on it.

votive

Okay, with the light 'dusting' (housekeeping!) behind us, let us pick this up. First the caveat bears repetition that we are now entering in uncharted waters which means friends, philosophers and guides (including scriptures) will not be able to help us diddley anything and the deforestation would need to be done ourselves while keeping wild beasts at bay should they not welcome us in their home-territory (wilderness!).

You add some very good and thoughtful points as usual, Votive ji. Liked your observation about the intro vs extroversion aspects of a chart (any chart!). As well as the left-brain/right-brain implications (you depicted it as the soorya-chandra nadi symbolism, which works too in the current context.

My surmise is that the linkages hinted at in your closing statement are evolutionary markers (for the soul!). As evolution continues on a given path or task, with recurring lifetimes, the 'markers and pointers' must line up too, if you are in tune with what I am thinking. The better linkages indicate that the task or project has become increasingly important for the incarnating soul and hence its CV (linkages) is getting larger! The new souls or new projects will perhaps show up as weak or no linkages and need to be figured out over time (lifetimes). For such, the important thing is not wait for the perfect moment, the perfect job, partner or whatever but to sample widely and then settle down on a project that feels right to the heart of the soul! And where is the heart of the soul, the next question naturally would come, right? And the corollary question: Can it be determined through astrology? Sounds like a marshy bog, eh? Did you remember to bring your rubbers (marsh boots!)

Love and Light in all seriousness!

Rohiniranjan

[Rohiniranjan]

Continuing...
The 12 padas in a chart can be viewed literally as feet/placement/moorings for a house. The feet are the base which is joined to another base: hips. We will come back to the knees later! Hips in turn join to and support the rest of the body. The hip region is where the dormant source of primal energy is, some call it kundalini, other traditions call it by other names, but the concept of the source of energy or 'burner' (as in a gas burner, bunsen burner, stove!). Hips support the rest of the structure above through the spine which essentially bears the weight of the entire upper body and through the spine run most of our meaningful cables!

I visualize the padas as the feet, the placement of the lord of a given house (under scrutiny) as the HIP and the house as the upper 'supported' but most important part of the framework.

So Lagna is this upper framework where most of the functional centers are and also the switches etc. Where the lagnesha is placed is the HIP, the source of energy for the total framework of what lagna depicts and the resulting pada (Arudha) is where the feet (moorings) actually are placed.

Similarly for the other 11 houses!

Upper: House under examination represents -- WHAT IS BEING SUPPORTED
Pivot: House holding the lord of the house -- HOW IS THE SUPPORT FUELLED?
Base: Pada - Where are the moorings of the upper house and are the pivotal energy sources functioning optimally

While there may be immediate applications (most jyotishis are preoccupied with those in terms of worldly agendas, needs etc) of this framework I am describing and sharing (to the obvious discomfort of some, for which my apologies and condolences) perhaps there could be more, were we to open our hearts and minds and not get too judgmental, hasty and dismissive, too quickly!

How it will evolve, I leave all to MA!

Love and Light!

Rohiniranjan

[Votive]

If I may....as we talk on Arudha padas, can we also ponder on the situation that the Arudha lagna falls only in the houses 3,4,5 and 9, 10, 11.

Or atleast, this is my observation. Viewing it in the North Indian diamond chart, it seems to be sending a signal perhaps. The symmetry of bhavas both on the visible and the invisible half of the chart is rather intriguing.

Interestingly of the so called dusthana or the houses 6, 8 and 12...the AL cannot be there.

Similarly, amongst the Upachaya bhavas, minus the Sixth, there is a 50 % probability of AL falling in an upachaya bhava.

Again, if we take both the trikona and the kendras, there is a 66% probability of the AL being in one of the trikonas or the kendras.

The natural corollary is that in the remaining cases the AL is in the Upachayas. This happens too only when the Lagna lord posits in the second, eighth houses for the AL to be in the third house and when the Lagnesh settles in the sixth and the twelvfth  that the AL is seen in the Laabh bhava. For the Lagna lord to be in the even houses...except the kendra bhavas of fourth and tenth, the AL is in the upachayas certainly.  

In my opinion, AL in third or 8th from 8th brings the sixth from  AL in focus , in this case, a  loaded bhava . Should be a person to whom people gravitate towards naturally, certainly not a recluse. With strong communication channel capability!

votive

My dear Votive,

My first (knee-jerk tendency) was to write to you privately, but then decided to voice my feelings and thoughts publicly. I am not sure why but after reading your thoughts I felt very proud of you! I have been fairly upset, lately, at what I have been reading on Yahoo fora and have been wondering at times: Whither Jyotish...?

Your thoughts provided much *healing* because this is indeed how modern jyotish afficianados must apply their minds to Jyotish. Long ago when I was gradually absorbing astrology from whatever source available: ancient, quasi-ancient and contemporary, I found it remarkable and somewhat disturbing that jyotish still remains imprisoned in minds as a religious entity, where gospel even where questionable remains walled-in like Anarkali! I also was a bit flummoxed by the nearly-TOTAL absence of any examples or real charts in nearly ALL ancient and quasi-ancient literature on Jyotish. More lately, the war (verbal skirmish?) seems to have become focused on and between contemporary jyotish scholars and such wasteful agendas. All this pains me personally, even though I have never had any personal associations with any group or following etc.

Though some may hastily run away from what they think is khichdi, but really it is kheer! Ma used to make kheer at birthdays and always included in her recipe, meva (kernels of dry fruit and nuts). Some children that loved both ate the combo and enjoyed it, others more discriminatory, first skimmed off the meva and enjoyed those, then enjoyed the rest of the kheer. Which one enjoyed the paayesh more, is hard to tell because both groups had a contented smile on their happy faces when they were done!

I liked the way you approached the matter of padas and rightly identified that only six houses can ever have the privilege of hosting the padas (moorings) for the 12 houses in any chart.

In addition to the statistical probabilities you provided, the repeating order (2x) of the padas (for the 12 possible placements of the lord of a house) are interesting to note as well (2nd layer of consideration, with the identification of the padas being the first layer), The 2nd layer repeating pattern (harmonic?) closely following the first half and the 2nd half of the chart in a paired dance of cosmic order. A third layer would be the pairing of different houses with the same pada, as if in a group - namely:
Pada  --  Layer 1
10  --  1, 7
3  --  2, 8
5  --  3, 9
4  --  4, 10
9  --  5, 11
11  --  6, 12
A subtle harmonic relationship would hint at a functional pairing between:
11-6,12 (11th house working in tandem with 6th and 12th houses which are connected through the pada linkages)
but 1, 2, 6, 7, 8, 12 being devoid of such linkages (not part of the elite pada group a sort of trisomy endowed with a degree of freedom-of-choice perhaps? Somewhat unencumbured??).

Let us think about that...! For these houses may generally represent the points on which the nativity must work upon and build, for better *mansions* that are in future, even distant future...?

I hope what I am thinking inside is coming across clearly and in an error-free manner (if the interface is working fluidly!).

BPHS gives an order of expression (sudarshan chakra chapter) whereby the planet placed in a house is the highest in expression (the floating and visible meva in the kheer). In charts where a jyotish stellium (has looser orbs than the tropical-seasonal astrolgy tradition!) is placed becomes a key house in terms of phal-bhog in a lifetime. If the dispositor of the stellium happens to be the AL or even AK or Lagna lord (one or more of these) indeed has the potential to be a major driver in life. As in the case you focused upon!

Thanks, Love and Light!

Rohiniranjan

I am not understanding this.

Rishi

Ranjanda,

Thankyou for your generous praise. If I may be allowed to question a bit more...

There is a visible and elegant harmony in the Arudha concept. If one looks at a trine of 1, 5, 9 , they complement each other to create a whole. If one looks at the other trines...12,1,2;  3,4,5 and so on...they flank and supplement to form an arrow or a wedge , maybe there are better descriptions around. The Arudha then a part of such trines and the bhavas not having the Arudhas too create a pattern.

So, why is the 12, 1, 2 a  trine  which is devoid of the pada?
More significantly, why are the 1 and 7 the leaders of such trines?
Why is the 4/10 axis more prominent for the Padas?
Is it some indication of our current duties in the present?

It is also worthwhile to note that if we notice the AL on the visible ( Sun/daylight/ Father/Path/ Duties/ Light ) part of the chart or the invisible ( Moon/night/Ma/Resources/Love) part.
AL in 3,4,5 bhavas ( Lagna Lord in 2,3,4,8,9,10) and AL in 9,10,11 bhavas ( Lagna Lord in 1,5,6,7,11,12) there is yet another beautiful and vivid symmetry. Depending on the sequencing of the chart, the person can come across as (or appear) to be focused either more on people or on the task, more emotional or more logical, the ida nadi more prominent or the pingla nadi. The continuum could either be benevolent or harsh, when we speak of "people" orientation it could imply a hermit or a Gandhi.
If, of course, as you pointed out, the AL is linked facilely to other key indicators, the flow is smoother, if not how do we try and work on it.

votive

Thereafter, I am not understanding this too!

Rishi

Rishiji,
I apologise if the messages were cryptic. I was attempting to delineate the patterns of Arudha Lagna.

Let us go back to the basic building blocks of Jyotish. The Lagna, the Lagna Lord are of importance when we start understanding a chart. If the Lagna Lord is in a “good” house, the Kendra or the kona it is said that the Lagna gets a boost. Similarly, the Lagnesh &nbsp;placed in the trik houses and so on bring &nbsp;different &nbsp;connotations to the chart.

It is felt that the six easier houses, the Four kendras and the Fifth and the ninth are balanced with the other six houses, the 2,3,6,8,11,12 which bring varied challenges.

The Arudha Lagna, by definition, is a function of the Lagna and the Lagnesh, a mirror or reflection or forward projection of the relationship between the Lagna and the LL. Certain special exceptions are also prescribed for its placement.

If, we examine the pattern, we find that if in any chart, the LL is in kendras to the Lagna, the AL stands either in the 4th or the 10th bhavas.
If the LL is in the 5th or the 9th, the AL would be in the 9th and the 5th. Thus the more benefic placements of LL in a chart would place the AL invariably in the 4/5/9/10 houses!

On the other hand, the calculations are such that the AL would still be in 5th or 9th if the LL is in 3rd or 11th Bhavas.
Further, the LL in the second, sixth, eighth and 12th houses would find the AL in the third or the eleventh.
Thus in every case, the AL would be either in 3,4,5 houses or in 9, 10, 11 houses. A very interesting pattern and from which I began my earlier message

Regards,

votive

[Rohiniranjan]

WOW!

Genuinely praising *ELEGANCE* is not about 'generosity' but calling it *as one sees it!*

Love and Light!

Rohiniranjan

[Votive]

Continuing...
The 12 padas in a chart can be viewed literally as feet/placement/moorings for a house. The feet are the base which is joined to another base: hips. We will come back to the knees later! Hips in turn join to and support the rest of the body. The hip region is where the dormant source of primal energy is, some call it kundalini, other traditions call it by other names, but the concept of the source of energy or 'burner' (as in a gas burner, bunsen burner, stove!). Hips support the rest of the structure above through the spine which essentially bears the weight of the entire upper body and through the spine run most of our meaningful cables!

I visualize the padas as the feet, the placement of the lord of a given house (under scrutiny) as the HIP and the house as the upper 'supported' but most important part of the framework.

So Lagna is this upper framework where most of the functional centers are and also the switches etc. Where the lagnesha is placed is the HIP, the source of energy for the total framework of what lagna depicts and the resulting pada (Arudha) is where the feet (moorings) actually are placed.

Similarly for the other 11 houses!

Upper: House under examination represents -- WHAT IS BEING SUPPORTED
Pivot: House holding the lord of the house -- HOW IS THE SUPPORT FUELLED?
Base: Pada - Where are the moorings of the upper house and are the pivotal energy sources functioning optimally

While there may be immediate applications (most jyotishis are preoccupied with those in terms of worldly agendas, needs etc) of this framework I am describing and sharing (to the obvious discomfort of some, for which my apologies and condolences) perhaps there could be more, were we to open our hearts and minds and not get too judgmental, hasty and dismissive, too quickly!

How it will evolve, I leave all to MA!

Love and Light!

Rohiniranjan

The three aspects of the flow, Ranjanda. Very well put together.

Unless the feet move well, the energy of the body cannot be swivelled by the hips in the stroke. Be it cricket or tennis or life, the feet have to move in coordination. A front foot pull is like to be caught by the fielder!

But now that you have begun, do not leave us half way, do describe your method or way of the three working in tandem. Illustrate, if possible.

votive

[Rohiniranjan]

Dear Votive,

In the scenario that I am watching and trying to describe, the feet do not move, but the padas are simply placed firm and holding the moorings! (not about cricket or tennis or basketball! Mere sports! That would be like taking the analogy too far and that is not kosher!)

I am not, nor have I EVER posed as or felt that I am a teacher, so please do not see such a one in me or what I share! There are many others who would readily oblige! Seek those...

But, like me, if anyone gets inspired to think further, please join the quest!

All I share arise from the scriptures which are like Anatomy classes, but has there ever been a surgeon who could perform in the theatre without learning anatomy (scriptures)?

Transforming knowledge gained from the dead to heal the living is where the beauty and elegance of it all rests!

From that point, onwards, it is "to each his own" or 'munday munday mati bhinna' as the case may be! But, in short, that is true for this vibrant reality known as jyotish too!


Love, Light, Reality!

Rohiniranjan

[Votive]

Sharing, Ranjanda, not as a teacher or a Guru but as fellow seekers!

Akhirkaar, Ma ke is gurukul mein satsang to hona hi hai, bin satsang hoy na jyotish.

The energy held by Lagnesh has to reach the Lagna for its optimum result. The pada has to help....

votive

[Rohiniranjan]

Sharing, Ranjanda, not as a teacher or a Guru but as fellow seekers!

Akhirkaar, Ma ke is gurukul mein satsang to hona hi hai, bin satsang hoy na jyotish.

The energy held by Lagnesh has to reach the Lagna for its optimum result. The pada has to help....

votive

Dear Votive ji,

Energy flows in from the Heavens as well as the Earth (the two gates) to become what some traditions may visualize as Elan vitale, the essence of life, Think of it as represented (in the current context) in the LL (and its modifiers, environment, and associated minutiae). From there the energy must flow (circulate?) to the house and pada. Striking a judicious balance between the two flows is the remedy for each of the 12 triads: H, HL, P. It is a mutually-beneficial sharing!

Love and Light,

Rohiniranjan

[RishiRahul]

...

Because Arudha lagna signifies the natives material image/how the native  is perceived by others; while the true lagna signifies what the native actually is......
We have a class on this at
http://mysticboard.org/vi ... 46&start=0

Am I missing out on something, as the question comes from you?

Rishi

Can someone tell me how this individual was perceived by others based on arudha consideration.

Karka lagna
Simha rahu
Kumbha sun, merc, saturn, moon, ketu
Mesha jupiter, venus

Let us objectively review this belief/observation/tenet/truism.


All the best,

Rohiniranjan

Dada,

Its not 'black & white' as this; actually.

Let us take any person named 'A'.

Now A has his own feelings + own perception of the self.
Even if both are added together, a clear perception of the person is still not achieved.

Why? because what A feels about the self is still an incomplete perception.
This is because the others' perception is also involved in knowing what A is actuaally.
Now this Arudha perception is not completely the others' perception; but others perception seen through material/tangible eyes. People believe in touch to feel & understand.( Some say this is a feature in kali yuga; but birth charts along with the other special lagnas existed in other yugas too).

BUT it is not as simple as that.

All these perceptions make a complete Whole; and also these perceptions are intertwined with each other.

The arudha Lagna arises from the true lagna, for which the true lagna is the most important; and the Arudha lagna is seen along with it for clarity.

For Practical purposes, I see the true lagna along with the Arudha lagna, atmakarak, amatykarak, palms, birth date for a complete view.

Now while doing the above chart analysis based on Arudha Lagna, I am missing out on Mars.
Even if we exclude Mars, for now, the lagna is soft karka, while the Arudha Lagna is mercury ruled Virgo.

The Arudha is more intelligent, organised than the lagna.
Others see the native as more intelligent or shrewd than he consciously tries to be.

Anyway, what do you view Arudha Lagna as?

RishiRahul

Also The Arudha is where the lagna repeatedly applies it's intelligence, being the paka lagna of the paka lagna= so it is a perception we create out of our behaviour/basic nature/attitude.

In addition to the above mentioned about lagna applying intelligence... to form pada lagna; and other houses also forming respective padas, it is also a fact that pada means feet, similar to it mounted on a horse.

Rishi

[RishiRahul]

If I may....as we talk on Arudha padas, can we also ponder on the situation that the Arudha lagna falls only in the houses 3,4,5 and 9, 10, 11.

Or atleast, this is my observation. Viewing it in the North Indian diamond chart, it seems to be sending a signal perhaps. The symmetry of bhavas both on the visible and the invisible half of the chart is rather intriguing.

Interestingly of the so called dusthana or the houses 6, 8 and 12...the AL cannot be there.

Similarly, amongst the Upachaya bhavas, minus the Sixth, there is a 50 % probability of AL falling in an upachaya bhava.

Again, if we take both the trikona and the kendras, there is a 66% probability of the AL being in one of the trikonas or the kendras.

The natural corollary is that in the remaining cases the AL is in the Upachayas. This happens too only when the Lagna lord posits in the second, eighth houses for the AL to be in the third house and when the Lagnesh settles in the sixth and the twelvfth  that the AL is seen in the Laabh bhava. For the Lagna lord to be in the even houses...except the kendra bhavas of fourth and tenth, the AL is in the upachayas certainly.  

In my opinion, AL in third or 8th from 8th brings the sixth from  AL in focus , in this case, a  loaded bhava . Should be a person to whom people gravitate towards naturally, certainly not a recluse. With strong communication channel capability!

votive

My dear Votive,

My first (knee-jerk tendency) was to write to you privately, but then decided to voice my feelings and thoughts publicly. I am not sure why but after reading your thoughts I felt very proud of you! I have been fairly upset, lately, at what I have been reading on Yahoo fora and have been wondering at times: Whither Jyotish...?

Your thoughts provided much *healing* because this is indeed how modern jyotish afficianados must apply their minds to Jyotish. Long ago when I was gradually absorbing astrology from whatever source available: ancient, quasi-ancient and contemporary, I found it remarkable and somewhat disturbing that jyotish still remains imprisoned in minds as a religious entity, where gospel even where questionable remains walled-in like Anarkali! I also was a bit flummoxed by the nearly-TOTAL absence of any examples or real charts in nearly ALL ancient and quasi-ancient literature on Jyotish. More lately, the war (verbal skirmish?) seems to have become focused on and between contemporary jyotish scholars and such wasteful agendas. All this pains me personally, even though I have never had any personal associations with any group or following etc.

Though some may hastily run away from what they think is khichdi, but really it is kheer! Ma used to make kheer at birthdays and always included in her recipe, meva (kernels of dry fruit and nuts). Some children that loved both ate the combo and enjoyed it, others more discriminatory, first skimmed off the meva and enjoyed those, then enjoyed the rest of the kheer. Which one enjoyed the paayesh more, is hard to tell because both groups had a contented smile on their happy faces when they were done!

I liked the way you approached the matter of padas and rightly identified that only six houses can ever have the privilege of hosting the padas (moorings) for the 12 houses in any chart.

In addition to the statistical probabilities you provided, the repeating order (2x) of the padas (for the 12 possible placements of the lord of a house) are interesting to note as well (2nd layer of consideration, with the identification of the padas being the first layer), The 2nd layer repeating pattern (harmonic?) closely following the first half and the 2nd half of the chart in a paired dance of cosmic order. A third layer would be the pairing of different houses with the same pada, as if in a group - namely:
Pada  --  Layer 1
10  --  1, 7
3  --  2, 8
5  --  3, 9
4  --  4, 10
9  --  5, 11
11  --  6, 12
A subtle harmonic relationship would hint at a functional pairing between:
11-6,12 (11th house working in tandem with 6th and 12th houses which are connected through the pada linkages)
but 1, 2, 6, 7, 8, 12 being devoid of such linkages (not part of the elite pada group a sort of trisomy endowed with a degree of freedom-of-choice perhaps? Somewhat unencumbured??).

Let us think about that...! For these houses may generally represent the points on which the nativity must work upon and build, for better *mansions* that are in future, even distant future...?

I hope what I am thinking inside is coming across clearly and in an error-free manner (if the interface is working fluidly!).

BPHS gives an order of expression (sudarshan chakra chapter) whereby the planet placed in a house is the highest in expression (the floating and visible meva in the kheer). In charts where a jyotish stellium (has looser orbs than the tropical-seasonal astrolgy tradition!) is placed becomes a key house in terms of phal-bhog in a lifetime. If the dispositor of the stellium happens to be the AL or even AK or Lagna lord (one or more of these) indeed has the potential to be a major driver in life. As in the case you focused upon!

Thanks, Love and Light!

Rohiniranjan

I am not understanding this.

Rishi

Ranjanda,

Thankyou for your generous praise. If I may be allowed to question a bit more...

There is a visible and elegant harmony in the Arudha concept. If one looks at a trine of 1, 5, 9 , they complement each other to create a whole. If one looks at the other trines...12,1,2;  3,4,5 and so on...they flank and supplement to form an arrow or a wedge , maybe there are better descriptions around. The Arudha then a part of such trines and the bhavas not having the Arudhas too create a pattern.

So, why is the 12, 1, 2 a  trine  which is devoid of the pada?
More significantly, why are the 1 and 7 the leaders of such trines?
Why is the 4/10 axis more prominent for the Padas?
Is it some indication of our current duties in the present?

It is also worthwhile to note that if we notice the AL on the visible ( Sun/daylight/ Father/Path/ Duties/ Light ) part of the chart or the invisible ( Moon/night/Ma/Resources/Love) part.
AL in 3,4,5 bhavas ( Lagna Lord in 2,3,4,8,9,10) and AL in 9,10,11 bhavas ( Lagna Lord in 1,5,6,7,11,12) there is yet another beautiful and vivid symmetry. Depending on the sequencing of the chart, the person can come across as (or appear) to be focused either more on people or on the task, more emotional or more logical, the ida nadi more prominent or the pingla nadi. The continuum could either be benevolent or harsh, when we speak of "people" orientation it could imply a hermit or a Gandhi.
If, of course, as you pointed out, the AL is linked facilely to other key indicators, the flow is smoother, if not how do we try and work on it.

votive

Thereafter, I am not understanding this too!

Rishi

Rishiji,
I apologise if the messages were cryptic. I was attempting to delineate the patterns of Arudha Lagna.

Let us go back to the basic building blocks of Jyotish. The Lagna, the Lagna Lord are of importance when we start understanding a chart. If the Lagna Lord is in a “good” house, the Kendra or the kona it is said that the Lagna gets a boost. Similarly, the Lagnesh  placed in the trik houses and so on bring  different  connotations to the chart.

It is felt that the six easier houses, the Four kendras and the Fifth and the ninth are balanced with the other six houses, the 2,3,6,8,11,12 which bring varied challenges.

The Arudha Lagna, by definition, is a function of the Lagna and the Lagnesh, a mirror or reflection or forward projection of the relationship between the Lagna and the LL. Certain special exceptions are also prescribed for its placement.

If, we examine the pattern, we find that if in any chart, the LL is in kendras to the Lagna, the AL stands either in the 4th or the 10th bhavas.
If the LL is in the 5th or the 9th, the AL would be in the 9th and the 5th. Thus the more benefic placements of LL in a chart would place the AL invariably in the 4/5/9/10 houses!

On the other hand, the calculations are such that the AL would still be in 5th or 9th if the LL is in 3rd or 11th Bhavas.
Further, the LL in the second, sixth, eighth and 12th houses would find the AL in the third or the eleventh.
Thus in every case, the AL would be either in 3,4,5 houses or in 9, 10, 11 houses. A very interesting pattern and from which I began my earlier message

Regards,

votive

So dp we infer that the Arudha lagna can only be in house 3, 4, 5, 9, 10, 11 to it only?

Pretty bad in maths!

RishiRahul

RishiRahul

[Rohiniranjan]

Haha, my dear brother! You seem to have suddenly *bumped* this old thread after 7 solar/calendar months!

Why such a hurry? I do not understand

Had it been a human child, there would be cause for concern, because it would constitute a rather 'premature delivery'!!

Love, Light, (some) Levity!

Rohiniranjan

[RishiRahul]

Haha, my dear brother! You seem to have suddenly *bumped* this old thread after 7 solar/calendar months!

Why such a hurry? I do not understand

Had it been a human child, there would be cause for concern, because it would constitute a rather 'premature delivery'!!

Love, Light, (some) Levity!

Rohiniranjan

The delivery was premature actuaaly.

I was writing another post on perceptions & Arudhas, and while doing so I remembered this post, opened it after search & replied to it first, thinking to search for more insights.

Thanks,

Rishi

[Rohiniranjan]

Haha, my dear brother! You seem to have suddenly *bumped* this old thread after 7 solar/calendar months!

Why such a hurry? I do not understand

Had it been a human child, there would be cause for concern, because it would constitute a rather 'premature delivery'!!

Love, Light, (some) Levity!

Rohiniranjan

The delivery was premature actuaaly.

I was writing another post on perceptions & Arudhas, and while doing so I remembered this post, opened it after search & replied to it first, thinking to search for more insights.

Thanks,

Rishi

If lagnesh is placed in lagna, arudha cannot be in 1st house and falls in the 10th
if in 2nd, arudha in 3
if in 3rd, arudha in 5
If in 4th, arudha cannot be in 7th house, hence falls in 4th
if in 5th, arudha in 9
if in 6th, arudha in 11
if in 7th, arudha cannot be in 7th (from house) hence in 10th
if in 8th, arudha in 3rd
if in 9th, then arudha in 5th
if in 10th, arudha cannot be in 7, hence in 4th
if in 11th, arudha in 9
if in 12th, arudha in 11

Hence, we get arudhas in 3, 4, 5, 9, 10, and 11 only. Which is what Votive ji was sharing, months ago when the pregnant discussion began! &nbsp;:smt004

Rohiniranjan

[RishiRahul]

Haha, my dear brother! You seem to have suddenly *bumped* this old thread after 7 solar/calendar months!

Why such a hurry? I do not understand

Had it been a human child, there would be cause for concern, because it would constitute a rather 'premature delivery'!!

Love, Light, (some) Levity!

Rohiniranjan

The delivery was premature actuaaly.

I was writing another post on perceptions & Arudhas, and while doing so I remembered this post, opened it after search & replied to it first, thinking to search for more insights.

Thanks,

Rishi

If lagnesh is placed in lagna, arudha cannot be in 1st house and falls in the 10th
if in 2nd, arudha in 3
if in 3rd, arudha in 5
If in 4th, arudha cannot be in 7th house, hence falls in 4th
if in 5th, arudha in 9
if in 6th, arudha in 11
if in 7th, arudha cannot be in 7th (from house) hence in 10th
if in 8th, arudha in 3rd
if in 9th, then arudha in 5th
if in 10th, arudha cannot be in 7, hence in 4th
if in 11th, arudha in 9
if in 12th, arudha in 11

Hence, we get arudhas in 3, 4, 5, 9, 10, and 11 only. Which is what Votive ji was sharing, months ago when the pregnant discussion began!  :smt004

Rohiniranjan

Thanks for the elaboration! The relatively lazy myself after all.

I wonder what can we infer from this? as 1,2,6,7,8,12 is left out/not possible?!

Of course, as I am aware, the 1 is left out as Lagna & Arudha lagna cannot be same.

Rishi