Karka Ascendant : delayed marriage

[Votive]

I am afraid the learned Jyotishi did not reveal the specificities, only anecdotal and the technical grounds towards which Rishiji was indicating.

Technicalities see saw well with fundamentalities!
Afterall as it is said even God abhors naked singularity.

Votive

[Rohiniranjan]

Prior experiences, here-there-everywhere  ;-)
Karma's Kalkulated Kaprice as P.G. Wodehouse said (he used Kismet, tho!). I was being a bit facetious, at least here!

[Rohiniranjan]

...

Dada,

Following that logic, Leo lagnas would fit that logic more.

An exception: though Saturn is not a functional benefic for Leo Lagnas, it is not a functional malefic; in fact it gives fairly good results (if one is looking for a quote, I also read it in Bhavartha Ratnakara.

What do you think?

Rishi

My 2 cents:
SA lord of either 6 or 8 for can or leo
SA also lord of Kendra (both) so ? less malefic (Kendra dosha dictum)
One may argue over the moolatrikona angle (MT in Ken is better than MT in trika, but vice versa can be argued too. You want stronger soldiers at the front (battle) or at home?)
Personally speaking, I think Kendradhipatya dosha is an incomplete dictum (in practice) and overly bloated by xyz and q!
I do not believe Saturn as L7 is the 'clue' for the cryptic statement that Votive had us going on this 'merry-go-round' which we enjoyed so much!

Dada

[Rohiniranjan]

I am afraid the learned Jyotishi did not reveal the specificities, only anecdotal and the technical grounds towards which Rishiji was indicating.

Technicalities see saw well with fundamentalities!
Afterall as it is said even God abhors naked singularity.

Votive

Holy Mackeral my friend! What have you been reading these days! <LOL>
God is an x-ray machine and sees the real essence of HER Creation and not how they 'dress' (metaphorically speaking! Chola as we say in Hindi!)

Rohiniranjan

[Rohiniranjan]

Okay, let us see what numbers tell us, without taking other conditions (more than one factor). Do cancer lagnas (and leo and libra added for comparison) really tend to have difficult or troublesome marriages in a sizeable number of nativities? Please study the following numbers (prevalences) in real nativities:

A or higher quality birthdata (Rodden DB-expanded)

Total = 27002 nativities (100% ref)
Cancer = 2954 (3.2%) [100%]
Leo = 2816 (3.3%) [100%]
Libra = 2875 (2.6%) [100%]


Happy Marriages
Total = 881 (3.3% out of 27002)
Cancer = 94 [3.2% out of 2954]
Leo = 90 [3.2% out of 2816]
Libra = 88[2.5% out of 2875]

Difficult Marriages/bitter divorces/Extramarital affairs
Total = 700 (2.6% out of 27002)
Cancer = 73 [2.5% out of 2954]
Leo = 69 [2.5% out of 2954]
Libra = 91[3.2% out of 2875]

In the sample tested, (%) are prevalence in the larger population of happy or unhappy marriages

[%] represent prevalences of happy or unhappy marriages in the sub-population (cancer, leo or libra; the last taken as a control for comparison)

There seems to be neither a significant difference between the population prevalence nor in the individual three lagnas.

JUst like every other time when we pit anecdotal evidence or similar generalizations, the numbers do not support this claim from the astrologer.

We all and 'they all' have made, are making and will be making such statements, but please let us not stop there but dig a bit more and we shall see that such sweeping but attractive statements are more like a sieve than a bowl which can hold water!

I am not trying to belittle the jyotishi or others that make similar impressive-sounding statements and then we can find all sorts of justifications based on good and even flawless logic, but that is a self-defeating prophecy when examined against real numbers.

Love, Light, Earthly Reality,

Rohiniranjan

[RishiRahul]

...

Dada,

Following that logic, Leo lagnas would fit that logic more.

An exception: though Saturn is not a functional benefic for Leo Lagnas, it is not a functional malefic; in fact it gives fairly good results (if one is looking for a quote, I also read it in Bhavartha Ratnakara.

What do you think?

Rishi

My 2 cents:
SA lord of either 6 or 8 for can or leo
SA also lord of Kendra (both) so ? less malefic (Kendra dosha dictum)
One may argue over the moolatrikona angle (MT in Ken is better than MT in trika, but vice versa can be argued too. You want stronger soldiers at the front (battle) or at home?)
Personally speaking, I think Kendradhipatya dosha is an incomplete dictum (in practice) and overly bloated by xyz and q!
I do not believe Saturn as L7 is the 'clue' for the cryptic statement that Votive had us going on this 'merry-go-round' which we enjoyed so much!

Dada

Sorry, I flipped through Bhavartha Ratnakara quickly, but did not find mention there. Which means I must have read this somewhere, and formed this opinion somehow.

Anyways, Saturn is not a benefic or malefic for Leo lagna.
As far as I remember it has to do something with the moolatrikona house, but I do not recollect.
But certainly saturn is not a dire malefic for Leo lagna.

Probably votive ji can enlighten us more.

Rishi

[RishiRahul]

Okay, let us see what numbers tell us, without taking other conditions (more than one factor). Do cancer lagnas (and leo and libra added for comparison) really tend to have difficult or troublesome marriages in a sizeable number of nativities? Please study the following numbers (prevalences) in real nativities:

A or higher quality birthdata (Rodden DB-expanded)

Total = 27002 nativities (100% ref)
Cancer = 2954 (3.2%) [100%]
Leo = 2816 (3.3%) [100%]
Libra = 2875 (2.6%) [100%]


Happy Marriages
Total = 881 (3.3% out of 27002)
Cancer = 94 [3.2% out of 2954]
Leo = 90 [3.2% out of 2816]
Libra = 88[2.5% out of 2875]

Difficult Marriages/bitter divorces/Extramarital affairs
Total = 700 (2.6% out of 27002)
Cancer = 73 [2.5% out of 2954]
Leo = 69 [2.5% out of 2954]
Libra = 91[3.2% out of 2875]

In the sample tested, (%) are prevalence in the larger population of happy or unhappy marriages

[%] represent prevalences of happy or unhappy marriages in the sub-population (cancer, leo or libra; the last taken as a control for comparison)

There seems to be neither a significant difference between the population prevalence nor in the individual three lagnas.

JUst like every other time when we pit anecdotal evidence or similar generalizations, the numbers do not support this claim from the astrologer.

We all and 'they all' have made, are making and will be making such statements, but please let us not stop there but dig a bit more and we shall see that such sweeping but attractive statements are more like a sieve than a bowl which can hold water!

I am not trying to belittle the jyotishi or others that make similar impressive-sounding statements and then we can find all sorts of justifications based on good and even flawless logic, but that is a self-defeating prophecy when examined against real numbers.

Love, Light, Earthly Reality,

Rohiniranjan

It will be grand if we can do a deeper post mortem of this thing.

Somehow as far as I recollect, I have formed an opinion regarding saturn not being a malefic for Leo lagna; and that Cancer lagnas generally have difficult marriage, but I do not have any evidence at hand to support this.

Thanks,

Rishi

[Rohiniranjan]

...

It will be grand if we can do a deeper post mortem of this thing.

Somehow as far as I recollect, I have formed an opinion regarding saturn not being a malefic for Leo lagna; and that Cancer lagnas generally have difficult marriage, but I do not have any evidence at hand to support this.

Thanks,

Rishi

Unfortunately Rishi and Votive, (if listening), and pardon me for waxing analogical/poetical, all we have on our hands in the current situation is the "Shroud of Turin" :-(

So we could up spinning our second-guessing wheels, even more! Furthermore as I wrote earlier as an addendum to an earlier sharing in this thread,
...
ADD-end-umm...?: I happen to know very closely several cancer (sidereal) risings, and all but one had relatively-speaking (DKP considered...?) early or timely marriages! The one that could be called a late marriage, got married when he was approximately 27-28 and has saturn and venus in lagna and moon in the 12th with mars! ALL had pleasant and productive marriages and no one separated or ignored their spouse or progeny or in other ways had mal-experiences. One of those whose marriage lasted for decades and decades and decades (until death did (?) them apart (??)) did have a 8-9 year separation because the cancer lagna was CALLED upon by DESTINY to go abroad for studying but THAT physical and geographical separation was what bestowed upon those two the incredible STRENGTH that could have ONLY been destiny showing their progeny HER beautiful elegance! And, how FREEDOM-OF-CHOICE fits in, into the jigsaw puzzle!! Please ask me no more... &nbsp;

What I share does not in any way mean that those who made the strong assertions, which Votive shared, were wrong...!

My belief is that the astrologer had some reasons behind his strong statement (there could have been more than one astrologers involved as well!) but did not provide the "if also,... conditionals. Incidentally, all of these nativities had/have rather pretty wives aging gracefully and had charming personalities (not saying that saturn always gives ugly or darker complexioned (DKP considerations of course!) or strict-natured, no nonsense spouses, etc. What I have generally weaned myself out of are the stereotypes that books tell us, that saturn is like this, or moon is like that and so on. The associations, aspects, karakas etc and even the rashi/nakshatra dispositors drastically change the actual from the expected profile (given in books of any vintage). Same is true for the descriptions given for nakshatras, their padas and the whole gamut. Would have been so much easier if all those actually applied to a significant extent, because then we would have had a computerised astrology prediction program by now. I hope I am not sounding too curmudgeonish or jaded, but how can I deny what I perceived and see no point in defending those, regardless of when those were written (ancient or modern) or the stature of the person who said or originally wrote those?

The reality is that one has to sift through tonnes of sand in order to find nuggets of gold which do exist I am sure as well as unfinished, unpolished diamonds which appear in the mountains of sand and some rubble as well!

Now some are claiming that they get good results with the tropical zodiac applied to jyotish or no need to use the lagna chart but just rashi positions as some nadis say -- I say, more power to them who can! God is merciful and has left so many devices and designs for us to fathom the unknown, the mysterious, the mystical reality that in me brings up gratitude to The Almighty, rather than disbelief in those beliefs as long as they work, even if in the individual hands of a few! So, rather than chasing some one and only HOLY Grail, which may or many not exist, let us just praise the Lord and continue on our individual journeys!

They say that an empty mind is the devil's workshop. Maybe it is the mind that is the problem or at least the 'monkey' part of the mind! Let us all seek mindlessness and attain bliss! (That was facetiously stated, by the way! Please do not burn your astrology library or anything drastic like that!

Love and Light and (yes) some levity!

Rohiniranjan

[Votive]

I am afraid the learned Jyotishi did not reveal the specificities, only anecdotal and the technical grounds towards which Rishiji was indicating.

Technicalities see saw well with fundamentalities!
Afterall as it is said even God abhors naked singularity.

Votive

Holy Mackeral my friend! What have you been reading these days! <LOL>
God is an x-ray machine and sees the real essence of HER Creation and not how they 'dress' (metaphorically speaking! Chola as we say in Hindi!)

Rohiniranjan

Yes Sir, in essence, the singular, yet so plural. As Santa Singh said to Banta Singh, black holes are holes which are but black. For those who have a finite and linear answer finally find that there are ways and ways...so many entwined strings, each so complete yet innumerable, so similar yet unique.
Interestingly for those jyotishis, who believe strongly, the answers are there, correct but specific to them. If others follow the same astro logic, the answers are different.
Dont mind me, Sir!

I wander and ponder.

votive

[Votive]

I am listening, dada!!

votive

[Rohiniranjan]

I am listening, dada!!

votive

Only ONE has seen and if questions still remain, what got seen?

Or remained ...?

Dada

[Rohiniranjan]

Begin at the beginning, the caterpillar stated/suggested:

Given a choice would you begin at lagna, lagnesha or AK or something else? Where would YOU begin?



Rohiniranjan

[Votive]

Begin at the beginning, the caterpillar stated/suggested:

Given a choice would you begin at lagna, lagnesha or AK or something else? Where would YOU begin?



Rohiniranjan

The Lagna, Sir, in my opinion, is the beginning, the sign, the naksatra, the nakshatra pada and the string starts unrolling!

votive

[biltu]

Despite Saturn being associated with old age, I find that many 10 and 11 (makar and kumbha lagna!)tend to look more youthful and mentally also. Of course if Saturn is afflicted, then that would need to be considered. Mercury, venus and (moon) also tend to do that. Now not everyone will look or sound younger, naturally but a high prevalence of such, at least in my personal experience. "seeming or sounding younger than they are" does not mean that a 70 year old will look 27!

Regards,

Rohiniranjan

Every body say Biltu ji looks much younger then the actual age, 31 looks like 26 or 27, I wonder why. My ascendant dose not have younger planet. If my ascendant goes to previous house then Mercury and Saturn got connected. Maybe my birth time is false, given from hospital.

[Rohiniranjan]

Despite Saturn being associated with old age, I find that many 10 and 11 (makar and kumbha lagna!)tend to look more youthful and mentally also. Of course if Saturn is afflicted, then that would need to be considered. Mercury, venus and (moon) also tend to do that. Now not everyone will look or sound younger, naturally but a high prevalence of such, at least in my personal experience. "seeming or sounding younger than they are" does not mean that a 70 year old will look 27!

Regards,

Rohiniranjan

Every body say Biltu ji looks much younger then the actual age, 31 looks like 26 or 27, I wonder why. My ascendant dose not have younger planet. If my ascendant goes to previous house then Mercury and Saturn got connected. Maybe my birth time is false, given from hospital.

Check your lagna, dispositor, navamsha Biltu. Planet alone will not always explain. And remember the age-related awasthas of the planets too (baladi)