WHY COMPUTERIZED PREDICTIONS DO NOT WORK…?

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RishiRahul
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Post by RishiRahul » Thu Sep 24, 2015 7:14 pm

Rohiniranjan wrote:
RishiRahul wrote:
...

While every dasa works differently, and there are so many dasas, systems etc.

...

RishiRahul

...But do you good folk really think that a certain planet would be all that different in its indications, expressions, roles and attributes if it is ruling-operating in the different dasas in an individual?

After all each horoscope has only one sun, moon, Jupiter, Saturn etc., and their 'job description' (karmic signature?) is the same and kind of fixed at the moment of birth!

A somewhat related situation arises when folks insist that the so called parashari principles must not be mixed with the so called Jaimini principles, though both use the same planet as the spring-board in natal astrology. It is not as if the sun wears a Parashari hat during vimshottari dasa but a Jaimini hat when ruling chara dasa period!

A related curiosity question arises as to what happens to ketu in ashtottari, for instance!

Are we astrologers over-engineering the so called 'linear-logic' (works great and more often when designing bridges and machines, admittedly!) that we assume (simplistically?) to be the *engine* underlying astrology... :smt004

Love and light,

Rohiniranjan
Dada,

Nice question! and true that there is over engineering the so called works.

Ketu in asthtottari is most probably excluded for the same reason why it is excluded in charakaraks; so maybe sustenance and rajayogas as PVR mentioned.

But certainly, you will find that Jupiter in vimshottari behaves differently as compared to what it does in ashtottari or other dasas. For example Mars in ashtottari can give marriage while shani in vimshottari can do the same.

I do not use ashtottari much,but certainly the results of the planets are not the same for a planet.

Rishi
http://www.rishirahul.com
Astro-Palmist & Numerologist
Accurate timings & solutions to specific questions

Rohiniranjan
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Post by Rohiniranjan » Thu Sep 24, 2015 8:20 pm

RishiRahul wrote:
...

...
Nice question! and true that there is over engineering the so called works.

Ketu in asthtottari is most probably excluded for the same reason why it is excluded in charakaraks; so maybe sustenance and rajayogas as PVR mentioned.

But certainly, you will find that Jupiter in vimshottari behaves differently as compared to what it does in ashtottari or other dasas. For example Mars in ashtottari can give marriage while shani in vimshottari can do the same.

I do not use ashtottari much,but certainly the results of the planets are not the same for a planet.

Rishi
There are many who completely deny the a-pindas (not possessing bodies) or lunar nodes in the chara scheme, others introduce 'conditional' clauses; some view the nodes as reconstituted Swarbhanu (the corporeal origin of the nodes), so there again we risk building the edifice (castle?) of logic (reasoning) on the fogs and etheric fumes of ASSUMPTIONS! ;-)

Not criticising the role of assumptions or hooks that the logical part of our worldly minds create -- but questioning their absolute verity!

The flaw in stating definitively what you describe for Jupiter, mars and Saturn in different dasas etc probably assumes that factors such as rulership, functional beneficience (or maleficience) are secondary and need not be considered, a-l-w-a-y-s. Single factor mentality in other words!

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RishiRahul
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Post by RishiRahul » Fri Sep 25, 2015 4:11 am

Rohiniranjan wrote:
RishiRahul wrote:
...

...
Nice question! and true that there is over engineering the so called works.

Ketu in asthtottari is most probably excluded for the same reason why it is excluded in charakaraks; so maybe sustenance and rajayogas as PVR mentioned.

But certainly, you will find that Jupiter in vimshottari behaves differently as compared to what it does in ashtottari or other dasas. For example Mars in ashtottari can give marriage while shani in vimshottari can do the same.

I do not use ashtottari much,but certainly the results of the planets are not the same for a planet.

Rishi
There are many who completely deny the a-pindas (not possessing bodies) or lunar nodes in the chara scheme, others introduce 'conditional' clauses; some view the nodes as reconstituted Swarbhanu (the corporeal origin of the nodes), so there again we risk building the edifice (castle?) of logic (reasoning) on the fogs and etheric fumes of ASSUMPTIONS! ;-)

Not criticising the role of assumptions or hooks that the logical part of our worldly minds create -- but questioning their absolute verity!

The flaw in stating definitively what you describe for Jupiter, mars and Saturn in different dasas etc probably assumes that factors such as rulership, functional beneficience (or maleficience) are secondary and need not be considered, a-l-w-a-y-s. Single factor mentality in other words!

Dada,

Either you misunderstood me or I was not able to explain. As I reread I understood that I was not able to explain.

Let us say that a person gets marriage in Vimshottari Jupiter mahadasa, shani antardasa.
When we see through Ashtottari we find that the same native got married at Mars - Mars.

The above difference is for most people; but of course, an astrologer can justify the event through some related logic........... dasa wise different planets have given it.

Rishi
http://www.rishirahul.com
Astro-Palmist & Numerologist
Accurate timings & solutions to specific questions

Rohiniranjan
Posts: 7412
Joined: Sun Jun 11, 2006 8:11 pm
Location: N.A.

Post by Rohiniranjan » Fri Sep 25, 2015 2:19 pm

RishiRahul wrote:
Rohiniranjan wrote:
RishiRahul wrote:
...

...
Nice question! and true that there is over engineering the so called works.

Ketu in asthtottari is most probably excluded for the same reason why it is excluded in charakaraks; so maybe sustenance and rajayogas as PVR mentioned.

But certainly, you will find that Jupiter in vimshottari behaves differently as compared to what it does in ashtottari or other dasas. For example Mars in ashtottari can give marriage while shani in vimshottari can do the same.

I do not use ashtottari much,but certainly the results of the planets are not the same for a planet.

Rishi
There are many who completely deny the a-pindas (not possessing bodies) or lunar nodes in the chara scheme, others introduce 'conditional' clauses; some view the nodes as reconstituted Swarbhanu (the corporeal origin of the nodes), so there again we risk building the edifice (castle?) of logic (reasoning) on the fogs and etheric fumes of ASSUMPTIONS! ;-)

Not criticising the role of assumptions or hooks that the logical part of our worldly minds create -- but questioning their absolute verity!

The flaw in stating definitively what you describe for Jupiter, mars and Saturn in different dasas etc probably assumes that factors such as rulership, functional beneficience (or maleficience) are secondary and need not be considered, a-l-w-a-y-s. Single factor mentality in other words!

Dada,

Either you misunderstood me or I was not able to explain. As I reread I understood that I was not able to explain.

Let us say that a person gets marriage in Vimshottari Jupiter mahadasa, shani antardasa.
When we see through Ashtottari we find that the same native got married at Mars - Mars.

The above difference is for most people; but of course, an astrologer can justify the event through some related logic........... dasa wise different planets have given it.

Rishi
Rishi,

If planets (by attributes and even rulerships etc) worked like so, as you meant to illustrate then all our interpretive problems would have been over and we could blindly predict based on the tables given in 'dasa-effects' described in such chapters given in texts such as BPHS for any given dasa scheme etc, but they don't!

Or for that matter, all twins and time-twins would get married on the same date or become parents simultaneously, or succumb to illnesses and diseases, or lose and gain employment at the same time. Doesn't happen!

A computer program could then be named Varahamihir and no jyotishi would be required, ever...! ;-)

I suppose that is why jyotishis should not ignore texts such as laghu parashari to complete their education...?

Instead of chasing hit-or-miss formulae and quickies...!  :smt018
Rohiniranjan
========
JYO-LOGUE

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RishiRahul
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Post by RishiRahul » Fri Sep 25, 2015 2:47 pm

Rohiniranjan wrote:
RishiRahul wrote:
Rohiniranjan wrote:
RishiRahul wrote:
...

...
Nice question! and true that there is over engineering the so called works.

Ketu in asthtottari is most probably excluded for the same reason why it is excluded in charakaraks; so maybe sustenance and rajayogas as PVR mentioned.

But certainly, you will find that Jupiter in vimshottari behaves differently as compared to what it does in ashtottari or other dasas. For example Mars in ashtottari can give marriage while shani in vimshottari can do the same.

I do not use ashtottari much,but certainly the results of the planets are not the same for a planet.

Rishi
There are many who completely deny the a-pindas (not possessing bodies) or lunar nodes in the chara scheme, others introduce 'conditional' clauses; some view the nodes as reconstituted Swarbhanu (the corporeal origin of the nodes), so there again we risk building the edifice (castle?) of logic (reasoning) on the fogs and etheric fumes of ASSUMPTIONS! ;-)

Not criticising the role of assumptions or hooks that the logical part of our worldly minds create -- but questioning their absolute verity!

The flaw in stating definitively what you describe for Jupiter, mars and Saturn in different dasas etc probably assumes that factors such as rulership, functional beneficience (or maleficience) are secondary and need not be considered, a-l-w-a-y-s. Single factor mentality in other words!

Dada,

Either you misunderstood me or I was not able to explain. As I reread I understood that I was not able to explain.

Let us say that a person gets marriage in Vimshottari Jupiter mahadasa, shani antardasa.
When we see through Ashtottari we find that the same native got married at Mars - Mars.

The above difference is for most people; but of course, an astrologer can justify the event through some related logic........... dasa wise different planets have given it.

Rishi
Rishi,

If planets (by attributes and even rulerships etc) worked like so, as you meant to illustrate then all our interpretive problems would have been over and we could blindly predict based on the tables given in 'dasa-effects' described in such chapters given in texts such as BPHS for any given dasa scheme etc, but they don't!

Or for that matter, all twins and time-twins would get married on the same date or become parents simultaneously, or succumb to illnesses and diseases, or lose and gain employment at the same time. Doesn't happen!

A computer program could then be named Varahamihir and no jyotishi would be required, ever...! ;-)

I suppose that is why jyotishis should not ignore texts such as laghu parashari to complete their education...?

Instead of chasing hit-or-miss formulae and quickies...!  :smt018
Books and texts are always required for base knowledge and should never be missed out.

Rishi
http://www.rishirahul.com
Astro-Palmist & Numerologist
Accurate timings & solutions to specific questions

Rohiniranjan
Posts: 7412
Joined: Sun Jun 11, 2006 8:11 pm
Location: N.A.

Post by Rohiniranjan » Fri Sep 25, 2015 3:12 pm

RishiRahul wrote:
Rohiniranjan wrote:
RishiRahul wrote:
Rohiniranjan wrote:
RishiRahul wrote:
...

...
Nice question! and true that there is over engineering the so called works.

Ketu in asthtottari is most probably excluded for the same reason why it is excluded in charakaraks; so maybe sustenance and rajayogas as PVR mentioned.

But certainly, you will find that Jupiter in vimshottari behaves differently as compared to what it does in ashtottari or other dasas. For example Mars in ashtottari can give marriage while shani in vimshottari can do the same.

I do not use ashtottari much,but certainly the results of the planets are not the same for a planet.

Rishi
There are many who completely deny the a-pindas (not possessing bodies) or lunar nodes in the chara scheme, others introduce 'conditional' clauses; some view the nodes as reconstituted Swarbhanu (the corporeal origin of the nodes), so there again we risk building the edifice (castle?) of logic (reasoning) on the fogs and etheric fumes of ASSUMPTIONS! ;-)

Not criticising the role of assumptions or hooks that the logical part of our worldly minds create -- but questioning their absolute verity!

The flaw in stating definitively what you describe for Jupiter, mars and Saturn in different dasas etc probably assumes that factors such as rulership, functional beneficience (or maleficience) are secondary and need not be considered, a-l-w-a-y-s. Single factor mentality in other words!

Dada,

Either you misunderstood me or I was not able to explain. As I reread I understood that I was not able to explain.

Let us say that a person gets marriage in Vimshottari Jupiter mahadasa, shani antardasa.
When we see through Ashtottari we find that the same native got married at Mars - Mars.

The above difference is for most people; but of course, an astrologer can justify the event through some related logic........... dasa wise different planets have given it.

Rishi
Rishi,

If planets (by attributes and even rulerships etc) worked like so, as you meant to illustrate then all our interpretive problems would have been over and we could blindly predict based on the tables given in 'dasa-effects' described in such chapters given in texts such as BPHS for any given dasa scheme etc, but they don't!

Or for that matter, all twins and time-twins would get married on the same date or become parents simultaneously, or succumb to illnesses and diseases, or lose and gain employment at the same time. Doesn't happen!

A computer program could then be named Varahamihir and no jyotishi would be required, ever...! ;-)

I suppose that is why jyotishis should not ignore texts such as laghu parashari to complete their education...?

Instead of chasing hit-or-miss formulae and quickies...!  :smt018
Books and texts are always required for base knowledge and should never be missed out.

Rishi
... Unless one is *?blessed*?? to be under the tutelage of a magician-yogi-saint etc... ;-P

The jwala-tarangini factor...! (Jwala=flame, tarang=wave, 'ini' ending = female form of tarang; earlier mentioned in Chela Tales series presented right here on Mystic Board)   :smt031



Sometimes I wonder if the prevailing confusion running rampantly in cyber-realm is because of deliberately destroyed doctrines or damage and attrition thereof over time and total lack of regulation (including the politics, of course...!)  :smt024
Rohiniranjan
========
JYO-LOGUE

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