He Who Thinks He Knows, Knows Not

[sidewalk_bends]

The mind tries to defeat through reason. It attempts to overcome the unfathomable via logic, but what the mind refuses to believe is that it is not the only game in town. Fight as it may; Think as it may; It only knows what it knows. The heart knows. It does not assume. Quiet is its voice, soothing and calm. Wise is the one who listens to his heart and shares it. Wise it the one who assumes nothing, but trusts He who knows all.

Touch a man's heart, and you touch their soul.
Touch a man's mind, and you've done nothing but stroked an ego.

[TiggerKat]

Then what is it he does not know? For all are knowing, it is a matter of intent mixed with understanding. For if you do not understand what another has stated, is it  their intent you do not understand or could it be you do not understand what is being expected from you?

Speak from, listen from, learn from...your heart. Ego is of the mind.

[sidewalk_bends]

Should we worry about what is expected of us though? We can only be ourselves?

[spiritalk]

Perhaps when we have identified who that self is?

[MarcoAZS]

Perhaps when we have identified who that self is?

yeah but then we are already enlighted  :)

[TiggerKat]

For whom would expect something from ourselves other than God himself? Whom do we owe anything to? If one feels something is owed to them from another, they need to look within.

[Nassim]

We ourselves are more than this physical body in which we gain our physical experiences in our spiritual evolution.
We ourselves are part of the mystery.
I say that we are body(physical), emotion, mind and spirit.
We experience the limitations of the physical body, but what about the emotional "body", mental "body" and the spirit "body" ... these are various aspects of the same soul?
That physical part of us which senses that we are separate from the whole of the universe is only the focus of the self, so that we may learn; but our Self extends out over the expanse of all of Existence and is an integral part of the tapestry of what I call The Force.
We ourselves are the Mystery.  We have the desire to learn this Mystery.  If we try to define and name this Mystery we will limit ourselves.  Let the Mystery reveal itself.  Let us have patience.

Nassim

[stan]

Spiritual knowledge is foolishness unto the wise of this world. And even if he did want to know, he can not, lest the spirit reveal it. BIBLE

Jesus said, unto you, and has been given to know the mysteries of the Kingdom.

Jesus, speaking to Nicodemus- We testify that we do know and You receive not our witness.

One should consider that the heart has revealed many mysteries unknown to the wise of this world.

What you hear of what I say, is totally determined.

[sidewalk_bends]

Spiritual knowledge is foolishness unto the wise of this world. And even if he did want to know, he can not, lest the spirit reveal it. BIBLE

Jesus said, unto you, and has been given to know the mysteries of the Kingdom.

Jesus, speaking to Nicodemus- We testify that we do know and You receive not our witness.

One should consider that the heart has revealed many mysteries unknown to the wise of this world.

What you hear of what I say, is totally determined.

I agree in that spiritual knowledge can be foolishness. It means nothing if one does not bring another up with them, or brings others down with what they believe to know. Some use it as another way to one-up a person, as if it were the new material wealth. Some see it as another way to separate themselves from the whole, when they should be brining themselves closer to the whole, and understanding they are a part of it.

also agreed, that What I or anyone hears of what you say or others say is determined. We are given freewill but also willed to either hear or not hear, or see or not see, through God's grace always.

Perhaps when we have identified who that self is?

yeah but then we are already enlighted  :)

The scary thing is, some actually believe this, that is not to say, Marcos, you are wise beyond your years.

[stan]

I agree in that spiritual knowledge can be foolishness. It means nothing if one does not bring another up with them, or brings others down with what they believe to know. Some use it as another way to one-up a person, as if it were the new material wealth. Some see it as another way to separate themselves from the whole, when they should be bringing themselves closer to the whole, and understanding they are a part of it.

I agree with all the above but it is God and not the man that brings one up, or, one down. Get out of the way and let Him do the work is another way of saying it.
Your correct, that we can fall into the trap of Ego by using spiritual knowledge  to put another down, or, like you said, one up someone. May the observer also be aware that what one sees, are only one's own desires. Also, what may seem as a one up or, one down-is just the opposite of what one perceives. Am I - One Up ?
AS FOR YOUR POST STATEMENT I FIND THAT IT IS A DIRECT ASSAULT    ON ANY REVERED HOLY MAN WHO HAS EVER TAUGHT. Thats my opinion,

[sidewalk_bends]

I agree in that spiritual knowledge can be foolishness. It means nothing if one does not bring another up with them, or brings others down with what they believe to know. Some use it as another way to one-up a person, as if it were the new material wealth. Some see it as another way to separate themselves from the whole, when they should be bringing themselves closer to the whole, and understanding they are a part of it.

I agree with all the above but it is God and not the man that brings one up, or, one down. Get out of the way and let Him do the work is another way of saying it.

This I am not sure. I will have to think on it. I believe that God can guide a man in one direction or the other, so I suppose we agree on that, but I also believe that through it all we still have freewill. As for the get out of the way part, even in our perceived chaos, his way will be done or is done.



Your correct, that we can fall into the trap of Ego by using spiritual knowledge  to put another down, or, like you said, one up someone. May the observer also be aware that what one sees, are only one's own desires. Also, what may seem as a one up or, one down-is just the opposite of what one perceives. Am I - One Up ?

I don't think that's a question for me or anyone to answer except God and yourself for only you know your true intent. I can only assume, and assumptions lead to bad pitfalls. Or as you said, what one's sees may be one's own desires.

AS FOR YOUR POST STATEMENT I FIND THAT IT IS A DIRECT ASSAULT    ON ANY REVERED HOLY MAN WHO HAS EVER TAUGHT. Thats my opinion

If one wishes to see it that way, it really does not bother me. Reverence is an interesting word, because people revere others for different reasons, some of which can be selfish ones. As for teachers and students, we are all teachers and students, lest someone see themselves as more. To many a holy man has guided his flock to believe it is greater than others, and too many a holy man have guided their flock for self-serving purposes.

[stan]

Side-walk(quote)
This I am not sure. I will have to think on it. I believe that God can guide a man in one direction or the other, so I suppose we agree on that, but I also believe that through it all we still have freewill. As for the get out of the way part, even in our perceived chaos, his way will be done or is done.

Examine for just a moment, what you had communicated. You said that you believe that man has free choice at the same time you say that even in the chaos Gods Will will be done! I agree! Question is-----Do you See His Mighty Hand at work in Your Life and in all that He allows to be brought to Your Door Step??? ALL THINGS WORK TOGETHER FOR GOOD FOR THOSE WHO WERE CALLED ACCORDING TO HIS PURPOSES. (Bible) Now the question is, then why does God still find fault. For who has resisted HIS WILL?


 :smt017  :smt017  :smt017  :smt017  :smt017  :smt017

[sidewalk_bends]

Side-walk(quote)
This I am not sure. I will have to think on it. I believe that God can guide a man in one direction or the other, so I suppose we agree on that, but I also believe that through it all we still have freewill. As for the get out of the way part, even in our perceived chaos, his way will be done or is done.

Examine for just a moment, what you had communicated. You said that you believe that man has free choice at the same time you say that even in the chaos Gods Will will be done! I agree! Question is-----Do you See His Mighty Hand at work in Your Life and in all that He allows to be brought to Your Door Step??? ALL THINGS WORK TOGETHER FOR GOOD FOR THOSE WHO WERE CALLED ACCORDING TO HIS PURPOSES. (Bible) Now the question is, then why does God still find fault. For who has resisted HIS WILL?

I try to see His hand at work in my life and in other's lives, but I'm sure that I don't see it all. If I truly did, then perhaps I wouldn't do some of the things I do that aren't always that nice. That's a work in progress for me.

As for finding fault, I'm not so sure God does find fault. If there is unconditional love as I believe there to be, then there should be no fault, but rather understanding. To me I believe it would take much understanding to accept that everyone has a choice and to accept that choice. In all honesty though, I don't know. I do believe though that we are given many chances, even beyond this physical life we are still given chances and choices to make.

[stan]

stan wrote:
I agree in that spiritual knowledge can be foolishness. It means nothing if one does not bring another up with them, or brings others down with what they believe to know. Some use it as another way to one-up a person, as if it were the new material wealth. Some see it as another way to separate themselves from the whole, when they should be bringing themselves closer to the whole, and understanding they are a part of it.

I agree with all the above but it is God and not the man that brings one up, or, one down. Get out of the way and let Him do the work is another way of saying it.
Just for clarification to other readers, the second paragraph is what I wrote and not the first.

[stan]

sidewalk_bends (quote)
As for finding fault, I'm not so sure God does find fault. If there is unconditional love as I believe there to be, then there should be no fault, but rather understanding. To me I believe it would take much understanding to accept that everyone has a choice and to accept that choice. In all honesty though, I don't know. I do believe though that we are given many chances, even beyond this physical life we are still given chances and choices to make.

Unconditional Love? Yes, rain falls on everyone, good or bad. Unconditional love is not inactive but active. After all, if it is Love, and it is inactive than it is not good for anyone.
What are the sources you are reading that infer God does not find fault, or is this something God revealed to you, or, something you experienced of God? We love are children, good or bad, but out of love we correct and because we correct, it is because we find fault. Because we do find fault does this mean we do not love? If we find fault and must correct, does this mean we do not love? God is more than just some energy, or state of consciousness and yet, He is at the same time all the above.  :smt006